Question about bookmarks

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stdedos
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Question about bookmarks

Post by stdedos »

Is there a notion of a book's "Contents" being separate from "Bookmarks" (i.e. pages I note myself to be of importance to me)?

Or they are one and the same?
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TrackerSupp-Daniel
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Re: Question about bookmarks

Post by TrackerSupp-Daniel »

Hi, stdedos

I'm afraid that I dont quite understand the question. From a technical perspective, bookmarks are not part of page content, they are a separate object within the PDF format, essentially a map with directions to a specific page/coordinate.

If you can elaborate on your question, we can probably offer a better reply for you.

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Dan McIntyre - Support Technician
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DIV
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Re: Question about bookmarks

Post by DIV »

Hello, stdedos.
I think the other aspect of your question that could be clarified is whether there is some particular concern or situation that you are facing that led you to raise this question.

For example, you might be nervous that if you delete pages from a document containing bookmarks, then the bookmarks will no longer point to the right place. Well, with a quick test it seems that the pages to which bookmarks point get updated when pages are deleted from the document.

Or was it just intellectual curiosity?

—DIV
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Re: Question about bookmarks

Post by TrackerSupp-Daniel »

Hello, DIV

It seems that it may have just been curiosity, but time will tell I suppose.

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stdedos
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Re: Question about bookmarks

Post by stdedos »

I think bookmark in the "traditional", physical-book-copy sense:
I can mark the page myself manually, without (necessarily) affecting the book, or the Bookmarks (which, if done right, looks like a book's Contents).

I am wondering if I can do such a thing i.e. add a bookmark (and optionally notes) for myself, without editing the PDF-in-question.
Maybe something like an .xml that, if dragged together with the file, layers my notes on top of it.
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TrackerSupp-Daniel
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Re: Question about bookmarks

Post by TrackerSupp-Daniel »

Hello, stdedos

Unfortunately no, the PDF specification does not really allow for bookmarks to act as containers for descriptive text. The best solution I could offer there is the place a "sticky note" on the page at the bookmarked location. This would feel very much like a "traditional physical book copy" solution to the problem, with the "bookmark" acting as the part of a sticky note that sticks out of the pages just a little bit.

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stdedos
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Re: Question about bookmarks

Post by stdedos »

Yes - but then, that is saved to the PDF itself - and I don't know how "damaging" that is to the file itself.

Also, there is no "list" of those Sticky Notes - or is there? 😕
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Tracker Supp-Stefan
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Re: Question about bookmarks

Post by Tracker Supp-Stefan »

Hello stdedos,

The bookmark's name and where it points to is also stored in the document - so there is no 'damage' and either way you want to get information in the file accessible by others later.

As for sticky notes - they would be shown under the Comments Pane (Ctrl + M).

Kind regards,
Stefan
stdedos
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Re: Question about bookmarks

Post by stdedos »

For example, EBookDroid (https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=org.ebookdroid) has "Outline" for the "official bookmarks", and then "Bookmarks" for the user-created ones. All "user-caused metadata" are exportable (in epub format, next to the file, under RAW/settings.jso file).

I doubt the "natively" save anything to the file itself (but I could check)
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Re: Question about bookmarks

Post by Tracker Supp-Stefan »

Hello stdedos,

EPub is a different file format, and there it might be possible to have two 'levels' or 'layers' of bookmarks, but the PDF ISO specification is quite specific on what is considered bookmark inside a PDF file, how it should behave, how it is stored and managed by PDF software like our Editor - so I am afraid that anything that a PDF Bookmark can do - we already have it implemented.

Kind regards,
Stefan
stdedos
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Re: Question about bookmarks

Post by stdedos »

The file-in-question is PDF.

The difference is that, this app does not "mix" between the two, and does not alter the file or any of its structures, just because the user added a bookmark, separately from its outline.
In the same way, a physical book is not modified if you insert a bookmark into it.
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Re: Question about bookmarks

Post by Tracker Supp-Stefan »

Hello stdedos,

Then that Epub tool is likely offering something that is not standard for the PDF specification. Can you please share a sample of one such document along with some screenshots of how those extra bookmarks are shown in the EPub software?

Kind regards,
Stefan
stdedos
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Re: Question about bookmarks

Post by stdedos »

Sadly, I cannot attach the book. But here's what exporting the "other data" looks like:
book_notes.epub.zip
(2.15 KiB) Downloaded 28 times
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Re: Question about bookmarks

Post by Tracker Supp-Stefan »

Hello stdedos,

Thanks! So I've looked at those files and they do seem to be created by the EPub software.
These 'bookmarks' are apparently some feature that they are offering and e.g. for .epub books that might be DRM protected - it makes sense to allow you to make some notes on top that the software would remember and store externally - but that is a solution for this software only, and is unfortunately not as universal or portable as a PDF file actually is. We are not looking at creating similar features in our software, and would continue to offer only the bookmarks feature that is part of the PDF specification.

Kind regards,
Stefan
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